Kicks

[J HepworthYoung]

Kicks seem underdeveloped in taijiquan for most of the people with more of a healing emphasis than a martial one.

In some books and forms; the kicks, such as in separate left and right, rise to meet the hand at shoulder level, this would enable kicks to regions like the underside of the arm and the armpit, even a heel kick to the chin is possible. However some forms have the type of separate left and right that you would expect to do if you had a giant belly in the way of your leg, these often include an oral instruction that the foot is never higher than the knee.

To me it almost seems as if the kicks are one of the aspects that one can find considerable variation on. Is there a single proper way to do them? I practice the kicks a lot lately and enjoy transferring my momentum into a strong kick well above the knee.

What are the teachings in the GRTC regarding this matter?
Obviously in the Michuan sword form there are some lovely kicks well above the knee. Is this a training thing where the application is lower, or is the form right on and we can use the kick both as an attack to the chest cavity and use it to remove a body impaled on the sword?

Hypothetically speaking of course, I love historical accuracy right up until we recreate the wounds in others.

[J HepworthYoung]

Maybe I can get a faster reply with a direct and specific question.

In the GRTC Yang public form transmission is there an oral tradition that accompanies the kicking that says never to apply higher than the knee?

[Linda Heenan]

I don't know about the public form but in the Michuan I was taught me three kicks that can all land much higher than the knee.

[Nik]

It depends on which people told their fashion. I learned piercing kicks to the temple, which are final showstoppers (possibly lethal), but that were people doing various things from Bagua, Taiji and Xing Yi. It depends on the framework where to apply those, you have to create the opening for using them. I think I saw head kicks in old Chen style footage when done by young people.

[Tashi James]

I always considered that kicks, stomps and sweeps are actually implicit in each section. For example, in first section when moving from the second shoulder strike into split a number of opportunities [in theory] are presented to collapse the right knee of the duifung amongst other options.

[Scott M. Rodell]

Kicks seem underdeveloped in taijiquan for most of the people with more of a healing emphasis than a martial one.

Unfortunately, people today ignore the teaching of the Yang Family that state one can not get the health (civil) benefits of the taijiquan without a through understanding of the martial...

... kicks, such as in separate left and right, rise to meet the hand at shoulder level, this would enable kicks to regions like the underside of the arm and the armpit...

The object is generally not to kick that high, but to be springy & able to deliver power into & thur the target, which would more typically be the legs or torso.

... it almost seems as if the kicks are one of the aspects that one can find considerable variation on. Is there a single proper way to do them?...

The older, more martial manner is to practice the kicks higher with more power than the other movements of the form as it is necessary to practice them this way in order to be able to develop powerful kicks.

... in the Michuan sword form there are some lovely kicks well above the knee. Is this a training thing where the application is lower, or is the form right on and we can use the kick both as an attack to the chest cavity and use it to remove a body impaled on the sword?

Generally speaking, the applications in the Michuan forms are preformed in the manner they are used.

[Aidan O'Brien]

Resurrecting this, mainly because it's one of the major things my Shaolin and Yang public instructor focussed on (mainly due to a large Taekwando school in my home town, that one of my friends in the same class also went to) was applications for and against kicks.

His major advice was, unless you're a master of kicks, never go above the waist in practice, but train high. For all the same reasons that Mr Rodell just said.

Bit of background, my friend who did TKD was one of those disgustingly tall leggy guys that could snap an axe kick out of nowhere.

Anyway, he was amazingly good with his kicks. However in the Yang Public 24 point form there's Jade Girl Works shuttle, or variations on the name, which he showed us was great for countering higher kicks, unless they were well set-up.

That said, for people that are a bit more stocky like myself and who don't really like big flashy kicks anyway, below the waist in actual combat is perfectly fine.

But still, he said to train as high as possible.

To me it almost seems as if the kicks are one of the aspects that one can find considerable variation on. Is there a single proper way to do them? I practice the kicks a lot lately and enjoy transferring my momentum into a strong kick well above the knee.

In this, there is not. I studied Chen style for a while and my Chen master showed us numerous ways to do certain moves. He also said, if there were two or more correct ways to do the movement, interchange them. Not just for kicks, but anything. So if one day it feels more natural to do a powerful heel kick, but the next to do a faster snap kick, or a day later an axe/crescent kick go with them, by mixing them up you keep your form fresh and alive, while practicing multiple types of kicks (if you're a stickler for pattern to help you practice and they come up multiple times through the form, have each one a different style of kick.) Obviously if in the sword form the blade gets in the way of a certain type of kick, keep your leg out of danger.

An example of doing it differently in the Chen form is leading into Immortal Pounds Mortar, where as you're coming through, your left arm can either come through higher, as an elbow strike or lower to sweep away a kick. Both are correct and depending upon the instructors views and preferences, both will be taught.

So keep your form alive and enjoy.

[Scott M. Rodell]

... tall leggy guys that could snap an axe kick out of nowhere.

Anyway, he was amazingly good with his kicks. However in the Yang Public 24 point form there's Jade Girl Works shuttle, or variations on the name, which he showed us was great for countering higher kicks, unless they were well set-up...

That is certainly true, but one has to drill it a lot with a partner who can kick that high so that you can move in quickly enough. An easier way of dealing with high powerful kicks is to void them by turning the waist just enough that the kick strikes air (in a fashion similar to the way we slip/void powerful downward or diagonal cuts in swordplay) while sweeping the hand up from the opposite side to catch the kicking leg from underneath.

[Aidan O'Brien]

... tall leggy guys that could snap an axe kick out of nowhere.

Anyway, he was amazingly good with his kicks. However in the Yang Public 24 point form there's Jade Girl Works shuttle, or variations on the name, which he showed us was great for countering higher kicks, unless they were well set-up...

That is certainly true, but one has to drill it a lot with a partner who can kick that high so that you can move in quickly enough. An easier way of dealing with high powerful kicks is to void them by turning the waist just enough that the kick strikes air (in a fashion similar to the way we slip/void powerful downward or diagonal cuts in swordplay) while sweeping the hand up from the opposite side to catch the kicking leg from underneath.

Many ways to achieve the same result. However, I had the fortune of having my friend who was my regular training partner willing to do the training with me, plus Jade Girl Works Shuttle is one of my favourite moves of all barehand. So I had a vested interest in learning how to use it most effectively. Besides, sometimes there's just not the opportunity to void and the only way out in forward.

In addition to that, while voiding is easier, sometimes a counter is more effective. Especially since if you're in a serious fight, if you have their leg pinned high, there is an almost instant win move easily available with your striking hand. Not ethical in sparring or competitions, but if I'm attacked on the street, I hold no higher honour than win at all costs.