Turtle Pattern duan jian

Sword typology and Edge Weapons forms of the Chinese Empire and related cultures with an emphasis on their relationship to Swordsmanship.

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Kenneth, H.
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Turtle Pattern duan jian

Post by Kenneth, H. » Tue Jul 03, 2007 7:49 am

Hello..

Mr. Zhou just rediscovered for a long time thought lost pattern welded blade. Mr. Zhou has had this blade lying around for the past 27 years without knowing what was hidden beneath the rust and corrosion.

The blade is obviously of san-mai lamination, and the pattern is referred to as turle-shell pattern.

Pics are listed below:

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I'd love some in-put from Mr. Scott M. Rodell on this specimen..
Have you ever encountered such a piece before?

Best regards, Kenneth A.H.
Zheng Wu Knife & Sword Company.
High quality custom blades by Master sword-smith Zhou Zheng Wu of China.
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Yu-Ming Chang
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Post by Yu-Ming Chang » Tue Jul 03, 2007 3:16 pm

This really reminds me of the pattern achieved by starting with steel cables.
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Kenneth, H.
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Post by Kenneth, H. » Tue Jul 03, 2007 10:04 pm

Yu-Ming Chang wrote:This really reminds me of the pattern achieved by starting with steel cables.
Those were my exact thoughts when I first saw the pattern, However I doubt a wire was used.
This is an old sword, most likely from around Qing dynasty. (I will have to ask Mr. Zhou for an accurate estimate).

Best regards, Kenneth A.H.
Zheng Wu Knife & Sword Company.
High quality custom blades by Master sword-smith Zhou Zheng Wu of China.
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Peter Dekker
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Post by Peter Dekker » Tue Jul 03, 2007 11:26 pm

Hi, nice pattern! I haven't encountered such a technique before.

Could you provide us a pic of the tang? I'm curious what it looks like.

In my experience, the more fancy patterns usually date from the 18th century, the majority of the 19th century weapons I've come across tend to be more crude and utilitarian.

-Peter
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Willing is not enough, we must do.

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Scott M. Rodell
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Re: Turtle Pattern duan jian

Post by Scott M. Rodell » Sat Jul 07, 2007 5:45 am

Just checking in quickly from the Estonian Countryside, Phil and I are here at the Swordplay Festival...
Kenneth, H. wrote:... rediscovered ...pattern welded blade... love some in-put from Mr. Scott M. Rodell...
Have you ever encountered such a piece before?
Not on a Chinese piece. It would be interesting to see a photo of the tang...

I'll ask Philip to have a look.
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Kenneth, H.
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Post by Kenneth, H. » Sat Jul 07, 2007 6:59 am

It would seem I got Mr. Zhou wrong on this one...

The blade is old, but it is not an antique...

It is one of Mr. Zhou's early blades. It had been rusting in a corner in his home for many years...
He cannot remember how he made it.. Haha!
He suspects that they were doing some twisting of several bars of steel at the time.. Which could explain the similarity between this turtle-pattern and modern made welded wire-blades.

Sorry I jumped the gun on this one... :roll:

Best regards, Kenneth A.H.
Zheng Wu Knife & Sword Company.
High quality custom blades by Master sword-smith Zhou Zheng Wu of China.
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B.Ko
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Post by B.Ko » Sat Jul 07, 2007 10:14 am

Hi Kenneth,

Hey even if it's not an antique, I sure that people who've seen it may very well be interested in such patterns!!
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Olivier D.
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Post by Olivier D. » Tue Jul 10, 2007 8:23 am

Sure, that's original, even for twisted bars of steel.
I wonder how the twisting could give that kind of pattern,as I am a poor connoisseur of the art.
I'm gonna try to be imaginative.
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Philip Tom
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"cable damascus"

Post by Philip Tom » Sat Oct 06, 2007 1:03 am

A friend who is a custom knife and sword maker produced some knives from steel cables some years ago. The surface patterns looked a lot like this. The blades were tough and very serviceable. He never made anything as long a s jian out of the material but I'm sure it would work quite well for the purpose. I see that this blade made by Mr. Zhou is a sanmei construction, the billets of cable forming the cheeks on either side of the edge-plate.
Phil
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